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ROOTS ROOTS ROOTS..really need some help on this one

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ROOTS ROOTS ROOTS..really need some help on this one

Post  jimmy cee on 4/6/2014, 7:25 pm

Last season was ok, 2 days ago when I was refreshing this cold frame, I discovered the entire bed, was full and I do mean full of these fine roots.
Only grass, a few unknown weeds are around, however all have been kept cut for years.
The lower part of the beds are about 10 years old, upper part I added last year, also included  weed barrier and 1/4 inch screen on bottom of upper raised bed.
2 feet from each bed end I have wisteria growing, I'm wondering if these could be from wisteria ?
3 other beds have no roots as this one does, wisteria is growing along the entire edge of all my beds..
I planted a bunch of kohlrabi, broccoli, chard and romaine.
What is seen in the roots below is only a small fraction of a root system in this cold frame.
I hate to think of removing the entire mix and redoing it, I will if necessary.
Any help please ?

last seasons plants

This seasons planting 2 days ago

unwanted..roots

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Re: ROOTS ROOTS ROOTS..really need some help on this one

Post  Marc Iverson on 4/6/2014, 7:56 pm

Holy cow, that's a lot of roots! Are you sure you didn't just disturb a hibernating hippie?

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Re: ROOTS ROOTS ROOTS..really need some help on this one

Post  camprn on 4/6/2014, 8:25 pm

Jimmy, I have the same trouble in my garden beds, it's absolutely maddening! They are all getting raised above the ground. That is the only way to overcome the root hairs.


Last edited by camprn on 4/6/2014, 8:28 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: ROOTS ROOTS ROOTS..really need some help on this one

Post  AtlantaMarie on 4/6/2014, 8:27 pm

Oh, my...  I have to agree w/ Marc!  And I'm afraid camprn's right about the only way to solve the issue permanently...

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Re: ROOTS ROOTS ROOTS..really need some help on this one

Post  llama momma on 4/6/2014, 8:37 pm

Flame weeder. Love the concept but not the price

http://www.johnnyseeds.com/c-253-flame-weeder.aspx

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Re: ROOTS ROOTS ROOTS..really need some help on this one

Post  meatburner on 4/6/2014, 8:56 pm

lm, you can get one of those flame throwers at Harbor Freight for about $25.00.  That is if you have a HF near you.  It is soooooo cool!  If it would take care of massive roots like those in the pics, it would be a great deal.

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Re: ROOTS ROOTS ROOTS..really need some help on this one

Post  camprn on 4/6/2014, 8:57 pm

@llama momma wrote:Flame weeder. Love the concept but not the price

http://www.johnnyseeds.com/c-253-flame-weeder.aspx
Sadley it wont help when it is tree roots and they fill the bed and choke out everything.

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Re: ROOTS ROOTS ROOTS..really need some help on this one

Post  jimmy cee on 4/6/2014, 10:21 pm

@camprn wrote:Jimmy, I have the same trouble in my garden beds, it's absolutely maddening! They are all getting raised above the ground. That is the only way to overcome the root hairs.
I do not understand what you mean ? "raised above the ground" my bed is 15 inches high for this one.

Flame thrower ?, how's that going to rid roots down under ?

Trees ? huge trees 40 - 50 feet away, no branches over the garden, none of the other beds have this problem, that's puzzling to me




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Re: ROOTS ROOTS ROOTS..really need some help on this one

Post  camprn on 4/6/2014, 10:23 pm

@jimmy cee wrote:
@camprn wrote:Jimmy, I have the same trouble in my garden beds, it's absolutely maddening! They are all getting raised above the ground. That is the only way to overcome the root hairs.
I do not understand what you mean ? "raised above the ground" my bed is 15 inches high for this one.

Flame thrower ?, how's that going to rid roots down under ?

Trees ? huge trees 40 - 50 feet away, no branches over the garden, none of the other beds have this problem, that's puzzling to me



jimmy, is your garden bed sitting on the ground??

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Re: ROOTS ROOTS ROOTS..really need some help on this one

Post  Marc Iverson on 4/6/2014, 10:25 pm

My neighbor's garden has tree roots coming up through his raised beds 30 feet from the drip line of his trees. I know because I'm the guy pulling them out. I wouldn't rule trees out as a root source.

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Re: ROOTS ROOTS ROOTS..really need some help on this one

Post  sanderson on 4/7/2014, 5:11 am

Mel's Mix and all that delicious compost is too much temptation for trees and shrubs.  I think (and I hope I'm wrong) that the mass of hairy roots I pulled from one bed last fall were from 3 possible trees.  If that's what is happening, then this fall I will raise the beds on pavers, maybe even a thin slab of cement.  Shocked

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Re: ROOTS ROOTS ROOTS..really need some help on this one

Post  jimmy cee on 4/7/2014, 7:15 am

"jimmy, is your garden bed sitting on the ground??"

camprn, ok thanks now I understand what you mean.
OMG if I need to raise my beds ? I will do it in my next life   Shocked

I wonder if there's a way I can have roots tested to see what they are?

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Re: ROOTS ROOTS ROOTS..really need some help on this one

Post  walshevak on 4/7/2014, 9:12 am

Don't count out any nearby shrubbery.  My Japanese Quince bush roots have take over half a flower bed.  My partial solution is to take a flat edge shovel and root prune  the bush on the bed side as deep as I can manage.  It can grow out into the yard as much as it needs. 

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Re: ROOTS ROOTS ROOTS..really need some help on this one

Post  jimmy cee on 4/7/2014, 11:04 am

@walshevak wrote:Don't count out any nearby shrubbery.  My Japanese Quince bush roots have take over half a flower bed.  My partial solution is to take a flat edge shovel and root prune  the bush on the bed side as deep as I can manage.  It can grow out into the yard as much as it needs. 

Kay

Kay, thanks.
Thats an idea. I have about a 15 inch space along where my wisteria's edge the beds, maybe I can dig down there to see if it's wisteria growing over. Then I ask myself why just 1 bed and not the others ? they are all fairly close to each other with the same mixture.

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Re: ROOTS ROOTS ROOTS..really need some help on this one

Post  donnainzone5 on 4/7/2014, 11:54 am

I had a similar problem in one bed near the fence when I lived in Southern California.  Shocked 

In the past, the borders next to the fences and brick garage wall (three stories) were planted with ivy.  Some of it had been removed, and some of it I removed, albeit with great difficulty.

Anyway, there was no ivy along that section of fence, but it was growing mightily about 8' or 10' away.  So, before each planting, I had to dig/pull out as many of the roots as I could find.  What a chore!  

Not to mention that the bed was placed on the spot where a hibiscus tree formerly resided....  But that was the only remaining reasonably sunny spot in the yard!

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Re: ROOTS ROOTS ROOTS..really need some help on this one

Post  jimmy cee on 5/7/2014, 9:12 pm

I'm thinking I found the answer to this problem.
Oak tree roots !!!!
There are 8 giant oak trees 40 feet away, the limbs do hover over the garden.
After digging down deep I found a fairly large root attached to these fine hair roots that wouldn't be of any weed, since the only trees in the immediate area are these hugs oaks I am going to assume this is my problem and I need to deal with it on a yearly basis.
I suppose in time all of my beds with suffer this ...

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Re: ROOTS ROOTS ROOTS..really need some help on this one

Post  Pollinator on 5/7/2014, 10:19 pm

@Marc Iverson wrote:My neighbor's garden has tree roots coming up through his raised beds 30 feet from the drip line of his trees.  I know because I'm the guy pulling them out.  I wouldn't rule trees out as a root source.

A farmer neighbor of mine has tree roots out into one of his fields more than 100 feet from the hedgerow. They like the fertilizer, apparently.

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Re: ROOTS ROOTS ROOTS..really need some help on this one

Post  sanderson on 5/7/2014, 11:51 pm

There are many articles regarding the expanse of oak tree roots. They are shallow and far reaching in old trees. I read many years ago that they can go out to 100' from the trunk. A lot of folks building new homes in our dry, Mediterranean foothills lose the old trees because they don't realize how expansive and fragile the roots are.

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Re: ROOTS ROOTS ROOTS..really need some help on this one

Post  walshevak on 5/8/2014, 7:51 am

@jimmy cee wrote:I'm thinking I found the answer to this problem.
Oak tree roots !!!!
There are 8 giant oak trees 40 feet away, the limbs do hover over the garden.
After digging down deep I found a fairly large root attached to these fine hair roots that wouldn't be of any weed, since the only trees in the immediate area are these hugs oaks I am going to assume this is my problem and I need to deal with it on a yearly basis.
I suppose in time all of my beds with suffer this ...
One word - tabletops

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Re: ROOTS ROOTS ROOTS..really need some help on this one

Post  Marc Iverson on 5/8/2014, 3:21 pm


One word - tabletops

Kay

+1

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Re: ROOTS ROOTS ROOTS..really need some help on this one

Post  jimmy cee on 5/8/2014, 8:40 pm

@Marc Iverson wrote:

One word - tabletops

Kay

+1
much much easier said than done...1 1/2 year ago

This past March before planting, I may raise these beds in the next life, certainly not this one....
However, I do have 1 bed to go, the one closest to camera, This could possibly be done in this life....

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Re: ROOTS ROOTS ROOTS..really need some help on this one

Post  Marc Iverson on 5/8/2014, 11:42 pm

Do you think it would help to just ram a shovel deep into the dirt around the outside of your beds once in a while? See if you get lucky and sever any surface roots?

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Re: ROOTS ROOTS ROOTS..really need some help on this one

Post  camprn on 5/9/2014, 5:43 am

@Marc Iverson wrote:Do you think it would help to just ram a shovel deep into the dirt around the outside of your beds once in a while?  See if you get lucky and sever any surface roots?
I tried this for a few years but e entually lost the battle. Now all of my beds are boxes with a bottom and elevated above the ground surface. It's taken two seasons to get that done. I have one bed to go.
Not only are the roothairs a problem with choking the roots of the vegetable plants, they rob the growing medium of all the nutrients.

My suggestion is to get the beds off the ground.

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Re: ROOTS ROOTS ROOTS..really need some help on this one

Post  jimmy cee on 5/9/2014, 9:45 pm

After the initial shock of this suggestion that I realize is an absolute necessity  in my case I am looking at this project in a different manner.
I suppose it would just be a digout and save somewhere, elevate and rebuild
I'm going to give this some long thoughts over many cases of beer ( I don't drink but I may start now ).
Actually on 2 beds I can unbolt my new side and raise them on the angle irons, their driven 4 feet down so they will hold anything..I could support the upper bed with blocks of 2 X 12s laying on the sides of the bottom bed...
hmmmmmm gimme another beer.......

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Re: ROOTS ROOTS ROOTS..really need some help on this one

Post  walshevak on 5/10/2014, 3:59 am

@jimmy cee wrote:After the initial shock of this suggestion that I realize is an absolute necessity  in my case I am looking at this project in a different manner.
I suppose it would just be a digout and save somewhere, elevate and rebuild
I'm going to give this some long thoughts over many cases of beer ( I don't drink but I may start now ).
Actually on 2 beds I can unbolt my new side and raise them on the angle irons, their driven 4 feet down so they will hold anything..I could support the upper bed with blocks of 2 X 12s laying on the sides of the bottom bed...
hmmmmmm gimme another beer.......

Sounds like a good winter project when the beds are not full of lovely growing things.  Although I love my waist high tabletops, you don't have to raise them that high, just get the beds up off the ground.  I had to replace supports under 3 beds this year.  It wasn't too bad.  Did 2 one weekend and 1 the next.  Gave me an opportunity to really clear out old roots and add a lot of compost to the mix when putting it back into the bed.


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