Square Foot Gardening Forum

Hello Guest!
Welcome to the official Square Foot Gardening Forum.
There's lots to learn here by reading as a guest. However, if you become a member (it's free, ad free and spam-free) you'll have access to our large vermiculite databases, our seed exchange spreadsheets, Mel's Mix calculator, and many more members' pictures in the Gallery. Enjoy.


Search
 
 

Display results as :
 

 


Rechercher Advanced Search

Latest topics
» TrolleyDriver's Compost Thermometer
by trolleydriver Today at 4:51 pm

» CANADIAN REGION: What are you doing December 2016
by trolleydriver Today at 4:42 pm

» CHALLENGE - Smallest possible footprint
by BeetlesPerSqFt Today at 3:16 pm

» GF Collard Greens, Kale Recipes
by BeetlesPerSqFt Today at 12:49 pm

» Butterfly Junction
by countrynaturals Today at 11:49 am

» 2016 SFG in Brooks, Ga
by sanderson Today at 11:48 am

» Garbanzo (Chickpeas, Cicer arietinum) and Kidney Beans
by CapeCoddess Today at 11:37 am

» N&C Midwest: December 2016
by landarch Today at 9:29 am

» What are you eating from your garden today?
by llama momma Today at 5:10 am

» Second Year SFG in Canada
by yolos Today at 12:13 am

» Holy snow Batman!
by llama momma Yesterday at 4:52 pm

» Tomato Tuesday 2016
by llama momma Yesterday at 4:35 pm

» New England, December 2016
by CapeCoddess Yesterday at 3:27 pm

» Bon fires on the Levee
by Cajun Cappy Yesterday at 12:17 pm

» Mid-South: December 2016
by Scorpio Rising 12/5/2016, 10:26 pm

» Mid-Atl - Dec 2016 - Seed Catalog ?
by Scorpio Rising 12/5/2016, 10:24 pm

» Gardening in Central Pennsylvania
by Scorpio Rising 12/5/2016, 10:21 pm

» 1st Seed Catalog Arrived :)
by Scorpio Rising 12/5/2016, 10:15 pm

» Amaranth
by countrynaturals 12/5/2016, 12:06 pm

» Northern California & Coastal Valleys - What are you doing this month?
by countrynaturals 12/5/2016, 12:03 pm

» Garlic: Freeze, thaw, and heave
by donnainzone5 12/5/2016, 11:14 am

» Live and learn
by jimmy cee 12/5/2016, 9:08 am

» AtlantaMarie's Garden
by countrynaturals 12/4/2016, 2:04 pm

» Mychorrhizae Fungi
by audrey.jeanne.roberts 12/4/2016, 1:28 pm

» December 2016 Avatar: Show your Winter Season Colors!
by Scorpio Rising 12/3/2016, 11:17 pm

» SFG not giving the results I expected
by No_Such_Reality 12/3/2016, 7:21 pm

» New Member
by trolleydriver 12/3/2016, 4:14 pm

» First season SFG results / lessons learned
by countrynaturals 12/3/2016, 10:36 am

» Eat Broccoli Leaves? Brussels Sprouts? Cauliflower?
by sanderson 12/3/2016, 2:55 am

» Winter's Coming!
by sanderson 12/3/2016, 2:53 am

Google

Search SFG Forum

Microbes...you gotta see this one !!!

Page 5 of 7 Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7  Next

View previous topic View next topic Go down

Re: Microbes...you gotta see this one !!!

Post  trolleydriver on 3/15/2016, 10:48 am

I've now got a "hold" on Teaming with Nutrients at the library. I'm number 7 in line so it could be a while before I get to read it!

trolleydriver

Forum Moderator

Male Posts : 2191
Join date : 2015-05-04
Age : 69
Location : Ottawa, Ontario, Canada

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Microbes...you gotta see this one !!!

Post  jimmy cee on 3/15/2016, 9:04 pm

@has55 wrote:
@sanderson wrote:Two clicks of the mouse and I accidentally Wink  ordered Teaming with Nutrients.  Has anyone besides CC started reading it?

Let's us know what you think. I'm behind the posse in reading the book, still on TWM

In the mid 1800s a German scientist developed nutrients that led to the chemical fertilizer industry as we know it now.
After a few years of using it and finding the negative impact on life in soil in his vegetable gardens spent the rest of his life trying to undo his teachings...and have people go back to  their own sewage as fertilizer.
Teaming with Nutrients..
Maybe a good read ? I'll go through it, however, lots of information in it that I am not particularly interested in although it's all pertinent to plant life, I am halfway through and I believe it could be a worthy read for the scientifically minded which I am not, although I am getting a much better idea on how plants function.



jimmy cee

Certified SFG Instructor

Male Posts : 1848
Join date : 2013-02-16
Age : 81
Location : Indiana PA....zone 5

View user profile http://www.jcjigs.com

Back to top Go down

Re: Microbes...you gotta see this one !!!

Post  Scorpio Rising on 3/15/2016, 9:43 pm

@sanderson wrote:Had a great score from today's mailbox!  

Bonanza!

Scorpio Rising

Female Posts : 3793
Join date : 2015-06-12
Age : 54
Location : Ada, Ohio

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Microbes...you gotta see this one !!!

Post  has55 on 3/16/2016, 2:37 am

I agreed with SR, Bonanza!!! Let's us know what you think. Thanks jimmy cee

has55

Posts : 1360
Join date : 2012-05-10
Location : Denton, tx

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Teaming with microbes?

Post  jmsmall on 3/16/2016, 2:08 pm

Matt Damon taught me how to enrich my garden in The Martian. Natural soil in Denver is only slightly better than Mars.

Jim

(great classic sci fi in the "hard sci fi" tradition.)

jmsmall

Male Posts : 10
Join date : 2016-03-15
Location : Denver CO, zone 5-6

View user profile http://paleopathologist.com

Back to top Go down

Re: Microbes...you gotta see this one !!!

Post  sanderson on 3/16/2016, 2:15 pm

We included The Martian under the thread "Winter Reading, Anyone?". I enjoyed the movie, also.

PS Back here on earth, human, cat, dog or any other meat eater pooh is not recommended for our compost.

____________________________

Find more about Weather in Fresno, CA
Click for weather forecast

sanderson

Forum Administrator

Female Posts : 12272
Join date : 2013-04-21
Age : 68
Location : Fresno CA Zone 8-9

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Microbes...you gotta see this one !!!

Post  sanderson on 3/19/2016, 3:53 pm

Bump

We have new members who may find this interesting.

____________________________

Find more about Weather in Fresno, CA
Click for weather forecast

sanderson

Forum Administrator

Female Posts : 12272
Join date : 2013-04-21
Age : 68
Location : Fresno CA Zone 8-9

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Microbes...you gotta see this one !!!

Post  trolleydriver on 4/12/2016, 7:16 pm

I think I need to read Teaming with Microbes again. In addition to our other veggie and flower regular soil gardens, we have two 4x4 SFG boxes (wood sides filled with MM) and behind them two 4x4 beds surrounded by bricks and containing regular soil. I'm undecided as to whether or not I should put SFG boxes on top of those two regular soil beds. The soil is pretty good. I'm saying that based on the crops we have been able to grow over many years. It's many years since I used any commercial fertilizer in that soil. I have added compost and peat moss from time to time. The one thing I have hated is turning the soil over by hand every Spring. But I'm thinking of keeping the soil beds and using some of the ideas from Teaming with Microbes, which if I recall correctly, means I do not have to do heavy digging in the soil every year. I can add some compost, maybe some MM and compost tea as required. If I do that, then I can put one or more SFG boxes in front of the existing SFG boxes and I gain more growing area. Seems like a win win approach to me.

trolleydriver

Forum Moderator

Male Posts : 2191
Join date : 2015-05-04
Age : 69
Location : Ottawa, Ontario, Canada

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Microbes...you gotta see this one !!!

Post  Scorpio Rising on 4/12/2016, 10:20 pm

Nice!  Honestly, a lot of that is intuitive, messing with Nature is usually not better.  She knows what She is doing! sunny flower


Last edited by Scorpio Rising on 4/12/2016, 10:21 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Not. Not,)

Scorpio Rising

Female Posts : 3793
Join date : 2015-06-12
Age : 54
Location : Ada, Ohio

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Microbes...you gotta see this one !!!

Post  sanderson on 4/13/2016, 2:48 am

TD, It seems you want to invest in 2 new SFG beds and just help nature with the traditional bed. As the TB worked nicely for what you put in it, seems like the best plan. You could add another layer of bricks or boards around TBs and fill the extra inches with compost, leaf mold, coffee grounds, etc. The worms should do their magic by blending everything and the microbes their job. There should be virtually no weeding or turning over in the spring if you re-top every fall.

I totally amended (well the worms helped with the micro turning of the soil and additives) a 3x3 spot with a layer of horse poo, topped with coffee grounds, Ecoscrap compost, cheap Kellogg', chicken compost, perlite, anything left over. 18 months later the bed is awesome with over-wintered, over-sized flowers. I accidentally followed TWM! Very Happy

____________________________

Find more about Weather in Fresno, CA
Click for weather forecast

sanderson

Forum Administrator

Female Posts : 12272
Join date : 2013-04-21
Age : 68
Location : Fresno CA Zone 8-9

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Microbes...you gotta see this one !!!

Post  trolleydriver on 4/13/2016, 7:59 am

Thanks sanderson. If I take that approach (i.e., a layer of horse poo, etc.) can I still plant those TBs this year or do I have to wait for the worms to blend everything in?

trolleydriver

Forum Moderator

Male Posts : 2191
Join date : 2015-05-04
Age : 69
Location : Ottawa, Ontario, Canada

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Microbes...you gotta see this one !!!

Post  sanderson on 4/13/2016, 4:11 pm

I didn't mean to sound like the authority!  I just meant that you can keep your TBs and really improve it to be more weed free and not need to turn it over each spring.  Just add more compost and mix in.

I amended this space in the fall of 2014 and planted in the spring of 2015.  The horse pooh at the bottom of the new stuff was still identifiable as pooh in the spring of 2015 but the depth of the 6-pack flowers didn't reach into the pooh much, if at all.  If you add aged horse pooh and compost and what ever you want now, you should plant what you normally do.  Over the summer, it should get better and better as the microbes, worms and other critters do their magic.

Here are the beds before adding anything.  You can even see a back of Kellogg's in the wheel barrow.  Lots of fine wood in it, but I just wanted anything organic in it.



This is the spot now.  There is one giant petunia and one tall flower plant I don't know the name.  Larkspur??  I just took this photo.  I dug down to the dirt and the ingredients are now unidentifiable!  

____________________________

Find more about Weather in Fresno, CA
Click for weather forecast

sanderson

Forum Administrator

Female Posts : 12272
Join date : 2013-04-21
Age : 68
Location : Fresno CA Zone 8-9

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Microbes...you gotta see this one !!!

Post  trolleydriver on 4/13/2016, 4:20 pm

@sanderson wrote:I didn't mean to sound like the authority!  
sanderson ... I always appreciate your advice and suggestions. It's all good.  And that is great what you did with your own garden.

trolleydriver

Forum Moderator

Male Posts : 2191
Join date : 2015-05-04
Age : 69
Location : Ottawa, Ontario, Canada

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Microbes...you gotta see this one !!!

Post  Kelejan on 4/13/2016, 6:20 pm

@trolleydriver wrote:
@sanderson wrote:I didn't mean to sound like the authority!  
sanderson ... I always appreciate your advice and suggestions. It's all good.  And that is great what you did with your own garden.
So do I, TD.

Kelejan

Female Posts : 4492
Join date : 2011-04-24
Age : 81
Location : Castlegar, British Columbia

View user profile http://www.castlegarinkspot.ca

Back to top Go down

Re: Microbes...you gotta see this one !!!

Post  sanderson on 5/2/2016, 2:22 am

I watched a TV program tonight, Chernobyl- 30 years later.  The area is still radioactively active and they examined the biological and botanical life.  The area is a tinder box of dead trees because there are no microbes to break down the plant life.  We understand why, huh?  A second point is that the leaves absorbed radioactive material before they died.  A forest fire would release all of that radioactive material should one occur. Shocked

____________________________

Find more about Weather in Fresno, CA
Click for weather forecast

sanderson

Forum Administrator

Female Posts : 12272
Join date : 2013-04-21
Age : 68
Location : Fresno CA Zone 8-9

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Microbes...you gotta see this one !!!

Post  CapeCoddess on 5/2/2016, 1:07 pm

Sad. Did they happen to mention how they would reverse all that damage?  For instance, could they spread compost all around?  Or kefir or beneficial nematodes?

CapeCoddess

Posts : 5374
Join date : 2012-05-20
Age : 60
Location : elbow of the Cape, MA, Zone 6b/7a

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Microbes...you gotta see this one !!!

Post  sanderson on 5/2/2016, 4:41 pm

This is what I heard or extrapolated from the program. Higher forms of life seemed to be less affected by radiation, depending. Fish seem to be able to repair their DNA. Insects were visibly genetically altered. Small rodents were suffering deformations until they were fed a supplied diet of anti-oxidants. This was just a test on a small scale. Larger mammals and birds - can't remember specifics, but a few were seen in the area. Yes there were defects. I suppose the word that best fits is survive, not thrive. Only the fish seemed to have cancer reversing capability built in to their genetics to be described as thriving.

The microbes were not able to survive, so "reseeding" microbes in the area might be hopeless. There are some extreme hot spots where something radioactive was just covered in site. I think they said the Russians were building a second outer cement shell on the previously poured shell. If I see it on again, I will post time and station.

Found a link! http://www.animalplanet.com/tv-shows/animal-planet-presents/videos/life-after-chernobyl/ I'm going to watch it again so I get the info correct! Maybe tonight. bounce

____________________________

Find more about Weather in Fresno, CA
Click for weather forecast

sanderson

Forum Administrator

Female Posts : 12272
Join date : 2013-04-21
Age : 68
Location : Fresno CA Zone 8-9

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Microbes...you gotta see this one !!!

Post  has55 on 5/2/2016, 7:12 pm

this year is the first time my cool weather plants like broccoli etc.. have not been attack by the cabbage worm or slugs attacks. Usually they start make small holes in the leaves in their night raids, then advance to full time work in the daytime. I see the slugs on the ground , but not in the bed. This the first year I consistently added the compost tea and garrent juice pro, which have ingredient for building up the soil food web. It seem to have stop everything in it infancy. We are in May and usually I have to spray BT or put the netting up. I'm impressed and that a understatement.

has55

Posts : 1360
Join date : 2012-05-10
Location : Denton, tx

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Microbes...you gotta see this one !!!

Post  has55 on 5/19/2016, 9:07 am

I was rereading the "Teaming with Microbes book" for making the tea. I missed it earlier when it said that the fungally dominated tea basically ensures prevention of powdery mildew and others, not the bacterial dominated. I think Jimmy Cee posted earlier he was making some. I going to make some monday. So far no diseases, but I going up my game. 
This note is on page 334 in Ibook(digital read).

“When it comes to outcompeting disease organisms in the soil or phyllosphere, fungally dominated teas have been used to prevent and suppress the growth of powdery mildew (Erysiphe graminis on turf, Phytophthora spp. on rhododendrons), downy mildew (Sclerophthora spp.), take-all (Gaeumannomyces spp.), gray snow mold (Typhula spp.), pink snow mold (Microdochium spp.), red thread (Laetisaria spp.), crown and root rots and damping off (Pythium spp.), brown patch (Rhizoctonia solani), summer patch (Magna-porthe spp.), rusts (Puccinia spp.), and fairy rings (all sorts of fungi).”

Excerpt From: Wayne Lewis & Jeff Lowenfels. “Teaming with Microbes.” iBooks. https://itun.es/us/jutHG.l



Powdery mildew growing on leaves. Compost tea sprayed on leaves can out-compete this and other fungal diseases. Courtesy Clemson University, USDA Cooperative Extension Slide Series, www.forestryimages.org.



Powdery mildew up close. Image copyright Dennis Kunkel Microscopy, Inc.

Bacterially dominated teas have been useful in outcompeting pathogens in mild cases of dollar spot (Sclerotinia spp.—severe infestations also require lots of fungal competitors), necrotic ring spot (Leptosphaeria spp.), yellow patch (Rhizoctonia cerealis), leaf spots (Bipolaris spp., Curvularia spp.), pink patch (Limonomyces spp.), and stripe smut (Ustilago spp.). Insects too succumb to the effects of compost teas, specifically weevils, grubs (Ataenius spp.), cutworms, and chafers; several reports attest to negative impacts on whiteflies, fire ants, and scale.
At the first sign of disease or insect infestations on any of your plants, apply teas and repeat in five to seven days. Obviously, a prophylactic application is best: if you have a sense of your yard’s phenology (seasonal cycles), you should be able to apply teas in advance of breakouts.
Finally, certain weeds are affected by compost teas. Clover and quack grass have a tougher time of it when ”

Excerpt From: Wayne Lewis & Jeff Lowenfels. “Teaming with Microbes.” iBooks. https://itun.es/us/jutHG.l

has55

Posts : 1360
Join date : 2012-05-10
Location : Denton, tx

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Microbes...you gotta see this one !!!

Post  has55 on 5/19/2016, 9:09 am

Jimmy Cee, how long at the end of the brewing are you aerating the fungi to get it separated from the homemade fungal compost?

has55

Posts : 1360
Join date : 2012-05-10
Location : Denton, tx

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Microbes...you gotta see this one !!!

Post  jimmy cee on 5/19/2016, 10:21 pm

@has55 wrote:Jimmy Cee, how long at the end of the brewing are you aerating the fungi to get it separated from the homemade fungal compost?
 
I've only one batch of the fungal dominated tea. Mistakenly, I added the fungal compost from the start, it appeared to do well, however, only testing can determine that and that's no option for me.
A terrific fungal compost was made, I forgot the container was there for 2 weeks. had it hidden and I did such a good job of hiding it, I forgot . I really have been busy with other things and hope to start these teas soon..When I do, I'll keep a five gallon bucket rolling 24 / 7.

jimmy cee

Certified SFG Instructor

Male Posts : 1848
Join date : 2013-02-16
Age : 81
Location : Indiana PA....zone 5

View user profile http://www.jcjigs.com

Back to top Go down

Re: Microbes...you gotta see this one !!!

Post  has55 on 5/20/2016, 10:13 am

I'll like to keep two  5 gallons bucket going. I need to get my verimicomposting garden buckets full again, but been busy with irrigation repair. On my last leg. But compost is cheap to get. At this stage I been applying my small compost to the beds and it's a small amount at this time. But I can get cotton burr compost, etc... at the feed store.

I can't find a way to contact Jeff for the amount of time to add the fungal compost, except to do it at the end, but no duration time mentioned. I'm going to review the bountea procedure, because they add fungi at the end of the compost time. I'll see if they have a duration time in their video or I'll contact them and post back.

has55

Posts : 1360
Join date : 2012-05-10
Location : Denton, tx

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Microbes...you gotta see this one !!!

Post  has55 on 5/20/2016, 5:19 pm

I thought I add more fun to the compost tea fire.
Some more watering ideas from old video by bountea's founder. His heart is in it. Now that we have more scientific understanding. His words make sense why it works.
Jimmy Cee , he uses a oxygenation method that similar to yours, but it's a shorter tool that he inserts into the bucket.




ok, I found the answer on the next video on how long to brew the fungi-30-60 mins after you complete the bacteria brew., if you're using the short cut method or brew 72 hrs to make it fungal dominated. They where way ahead of their time.
Has some good video on their website.but you have to stay there to see them. If you select youtube, you will go to see youtube and all kinds of other video.


more helpful instruction to glean from, unless you just want to use their product. I think the product are high, but maybe it cheaper when it use by usage. I don't know. 
Brewing Bountea Compost Tea

has55

Posts : 1360
Join date : 2012-05-10
Location : Denton, tx

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Microbes...you gotta see this one !!!

Post  has55 on 5/20/2016, 5:57 pm

@jimmy cee wrote:
@has55 wrote:Jimmy Cee, how long at the end of the brewing are you aerating the fungi to get it separated from the homemade fungal compost?
 
I've only one batch of the fungal dominated tea. Mistakenly, I added the fungal compost from the start, it appeared to do well, however, only testing can determine that and that's no option for me.
A terrific fungal compost was made, I forgot the container was there for 2 weeks. had it hidden and I did such a good job of hiding it, I forgot . I really have been busy with other things and hope to start these teas soon..When I do, I'll keep a five gallon bucket rolling 24 / 7.
I made my first batch wrong, but I believe I'll still get the fungus. Went to the store with DW to gets some oatmeal. She asked me if I knew what I needed. I got the big head and said, "yes". SO I purchased the value pack oatmeal, poured out three packages into a bowl and soak till moist and place in closet. Later, went back to looked at the recipes and found I got the instructions wrong. I was to use compost and mixed in 3-4 four TBS in a cup of compost material. The SQF Journey is well on it's way.

“Give fungi a head start
Many new to tea brewing become frustrated because it can be difficult to grow fungi in quantities sufficient to make a balanced tea, much less a fungally dominated one. This is because bacteria not only grow but multiply rapidly in tea given adequate nutrition; whereas the brew time is almost never long enough for fungi to multiply in tea—they only grow bigger. The better way is to activate fungi in the compost prior to making tea, allowing populations to multiply before they are teased out of the compost and into the tea brew.
This activation is easily accomplished: several days ”
“before brewing the tea, mix the compost with simple proteins that serve as a good fungal food—such things as soybean meal, powdered malt, oatmeal, oat bran, or, best of all, powdered baby oatmeal. Thoroughly mix in one of these at the rate of three or four tablespoons per cup of compost. Make sure there is sufficient moisture in the compost, which is to say a drop of moisture can be squeezed out of a fistful of it. Put the mixture in a container, and place the container in a warm, dark place. A seed-germinating mat, placed beneath the container, works great to provide the proper heat.
After about three days at 80F (27C), the fungi in your compost, if you had sufficient numbers of them in the first instance, will have grown, and their invisible hyphal threads merged into a network of visible mycelia. The compost should look like Santa Claus’s beard, covered with long, white, fluffy strands. In a few more days, there will be so many fungal threads, the entire container of compost will be glued together.”

Excerpt From: Wayne Lewis & Jeff Lowenfels. “Teaming with Microbes.” iBooks. https://itun.es/us/jutHG.l

has55

Posts : 1360
Join date : 2012-05-10
Location : Denton, tx

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Microbes...you gotta see this one !!!

Post  has55 on 5/20/2016, 6:05 pm

I found more info on using compost tea that's fungally dominated to stop and prevent disease in tomatoes.
Great Pictures!!!
Challenging your Knowledge on Creating Fertile Soils…

has55

Posts : 1360
Join date : 2012-05-10
Location : Denton, tx

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Microbes...you gotta see this one !!!

Post  Sponsored content Today at 5:05 pm


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

Page 5 of 7 Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7  Next

View previous topic View next topic Back to top


 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum