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Is there any hope?

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Is there any hope?

Post  middlemamma on 5/21/2010, 11:37 pm

I missed beating a unexpected frost by one day.

I went to Home Depot last night and purchased PVC and plastic with intentions to erect them this evening when I got home.

I went out this evening to erect my covers and found wilted and very "beyond help" looking basil, tomatos, cukes, yellow squash, zuchini, jalepeno & grean/red bell peppers.

Here are photos...I am posting here because I have no idea if I just pull them up and start again...or see if they come back. They sure don't look like that is even possible. My strawberries even took a hit and I thought they were resistant.











































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Re: Is there any hope?

Post  Chopper on 5/22/2010, 12:18 am

Ow! It makes me want to cry.

However, I am of the never say die school. Some of those may come back, a few really do look like they will not make it.

So, if you will be buying plants - you might want to wait a few days and see how everything looks then. If some of these are from seeds, by all means throw some seeds in, but don't take out the old one. For two reasons. One is that should there be another frost, the old one may protect the new one and two, if the old one comes back, you have saved yourself a few weeks and lost nothing but are prepared in case the old one never looks happy again.

Otherwise - go to the garden center and buy the biggest plants you can find and be done with it.


Last edited by Chopper on 5/22/2010, 12:39 am; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Is there any hope?

Post  Paintedlady on 5/22/2010, 12:23 am

Ouch! So sorry that happened! I agree it looks as if some of them will not make it, but I'd also wait a couple days and see if any of them make a turn around. Such a bummer!

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Re: Is there any hope?

Post  middlemamma on 5/22/2010, 12:31 am

I went ahead and erected the covers and put them up tonight.

We'll see. I can't imagine they are going to make it. (shaking head) I am so thankful I took Mel's advice and didnt do seeds this first year...I would be in much worse shape emotionally I think. These were all transplants. I have carrots, radish and green onions in, all seeds, and the radish sprouts seem uneffected. My thyme is fine, and the sunflowers, black eyed susans and other flowers haven't sprouted yet either so hopefully the freeze didnt end the hope of their sprouting. Maybe a few days with a green house effect in the warmth of day will help those little guys.

I HATE learning the hard way... Sad

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Re: Is there any hope?

Post  SirTravers on 5/22/2010, 12:34 am

My hat is off to ya. I'm at the other end of the scale already. I'm watching my daytime temps creep into the 90's for short periods of time. My cold weather stuff isn't quite mature, but the summer is trying to come to the oilpatch a little early! affraid
Hope some of your babies perk back up.

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Re: Is there any hope?

Post  silverbug on 5/22/2010, 7:34 am

*cringe* *wince* I'm so sorry that happened. Ouch is right. I really nearly teared up looking at those photo's. I would be devestated. You may be surprised by a few of those items, while others, well....that's why they have more at the garden center. Nurture them, clip off really dead leaves, let them get over the shock with some spa treatments in the covered hoops. Good luck....

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Re: Is there any hope?

Post  Megan on 5/22/2010, 7:43 am

Oh, middlemama, I'm so sorry to see all that, ouch! Sad You still have time, though!

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Re: Is there any hope?

Post  timwardell on 5/22/2010, 7:56 am

I am deeply sorry for your loss. ... May they rest in peace.

Have you noticed that they don't make sympathy cards for gardeners? Why is that? You'd think a gardening supplies company somewhere would have jumped on such an opportunity given that there are so many reasons a gardener would need a sympahty card - often several times in a single season - especially if they row garden! ;-D

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Re: Is there any hope?

Post  Megan on 5/22/2010, 8:08 am

Boy, now there is a marketing niche! Perhaps a little "Welcome!" card for each time you plant a new square foot, too!

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Re: Is there any hope?

Post  camprn on 5/22/2010, 8:32 am

Wow, it really got cold! that stinks. The only thing I can see that fared well is the strawbs. Time for more starts and please do post photo after you get the hoop up. I am in zone 5a & I am itching to put in warm weather vegetable starts, but I am going to waiting another week. More seeds are going in the ground this weekend though. Hang in there, all is not lost.

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Re: Is there any hope?

Post  Kabaju42 on 5/22/2010, 11:14 am

Ouch, that does hurt. I don't know if most of those will survive. The good news is the strawberry plants look just fine to me. I'd say give the plants a week or two, then buy replacements for the ones that don't survive. You'll still have plenty of time in the year if you wait two weeks.

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Re: Is there any hope?

Post  donnainzone5 on 5/22/2010, 2:35 pm

I second the advice to trim off the lower, REALLY damaged lower leaves. Many of your plants look as if they will survive.

My practice is to pull or clip off any dead or damaged leaves, and the plants seem to thank me for it.

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Re: Is there any hope?

Post  Lavender Debs on 5/22/2010, 3:53 pm

Hugs mm!
I'm just sick about your garden.

My 2 cents worth.......
I would replant everything but the strawberries. The reason your strawberries got a little punkey was because new growth is tender and will freeze as easily as your other plants. If they were not new plants they might have been fine with a freeze but often plants come from Florida, Arizona or California.

Even if you have some plants that survive, you might still be better off replanting. Survive and thrive are not the same. You want the energy of your plant to go into making edible parts, not to surviving. A fresh start might be just the thing

It sounds like you have a high number of tropical plants (tomatoes, peppers, squash, cucumbers and basil) Last frost date is not late enough for peppers and squash/cucumbers. It is a bit early for tomatoes and basil. I like to wait until nights have been above about 48 degrees for a few NIGHTS for tomatoes (beans too). For peppers and squash I like to wait until nights are generally above 55 to 60 degrees.

Now is a good time for greens/lettuce, for broccoli and cauliflower, carrots, maybe radishes and cilantro. Take a breath, get yourself some seeds and don't look back.

Both of these were started March 1. They are the same type of tomato, from the same seed packet. The first one (the best looking of the bunch at the time) was planted in mid April when nights were about 45 degrees but soon dropped to lower 40's and 38 degrees one night. Not freezing but not happy tomato nights (it is a topsy tervy, I need to say that to be fair). The 2nd one was put in last Monday (a little earlier than I wanted to but circumstances dictated my choice) but look how much better they look. They had a few nights of low 50's before our latest cold front came in.




The first plant is surviving; the 2nd is thriving by north-west standards. I wouldn’t even think about putting in peppers or pumpkins yet (I am west of the Cascades)

Deborah......who doesn't think you need to worry about replanting right away in the north. Idaho will get crazy hot before you know what hit you. (even with protection, make sure you know what your minimum temp is IN the cover.

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Re: Is there any hope?

Post  middlemamma on 5/23/2010, 1:33 am

Thanks everybody...I appreciate all the help, kind words, advice...I think I pouted and am moving forward.

HOWEVER....I am SO CONFUSED. I don't understand the way to tell when to plant and the frost dates etc. I looked at a couple places online and it says I should be safe after May 27th. So do i do that? And does that mean no seeds? only starts because of a short growing season here?

Deb- I pinched off the bad leaves on the strawberries, and I think they will make it. They are all covered tonight with plastic, and they were greenhousing a bit this afternoon, although tonight is to be another cold one.

I put some seeds in some peat pots a couple months ago because I thought what they hey....I figured it was too late for seeds, I should have started them in January...but I just wanted to see what would happen.

So I have several little tomato seedlings and cucumber seedlings. But when I look at them I cannot imagine them giving me fruit this season???

I have never tried to grow anything. So I KNOW nothing. And even reading quite a bit the last couple months its amazing what books ASSUME that you know. For instance I went to the store to get pvc like mel suggests and plastic. ANd then i am standing there like a moron thinking...PLASTIC....what the bleep KIND of plastic? So I got some painters 3.5 mil plastic from the paint department and hoped it wasnt the wrong thing. I came home looked in a coupl eof my books....NOTHING about WHAT KIND OF plastic...lol

So here is where I am. I have pumpkin seeds in peat pots in the house, havent emerged. I have tomato and cuke seedlings in the house...pic below...maybe you could let me know if they are worth planting in a few weeks? They just look so GANGLY to me?
I am going to take out all that died..pray for the strawberries. I have thyme out there that looks great. I have radish sprouts that look great, garlic sprouts that look great. I have sunflowers, carrots, green onions that havent sprouted. The purple sorn flowers and the black eyed susans have little green leaves emerging and they appear green and great, no brown or black or shriveling.






Thanks everyone....all the comments and help are appreciated as I have NO CLUE what I am doing...but really do want to learn.

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Re: Is there any hope?

Post  SirTravers on 5/23/2010, 2:01 am

Aw don't feel bad gal. I learned how to garden around Memphis TN then ended up here in southeast New Mexico. I found SFG because all the methods I'd learned were not working here. This is new to me also, but gosh it's sure fun experimenting huh?
As far as your leggy seedlings..they need more intense light. That's why they're stretching. It's like little kids reaching for a cookie, Give them a sunny window and also start hardening them off by taking them outside for short periods of time each day. That'll thicken up their stalks. The plastic....yeah painters plastic works. I can't use it here because of the wild temp. swings I get each day. Maybe I'm crazy but I've done a lot of direct seeding outside. I figure it can't hurt to try.

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Re: Is there any hope?

Post  Chopper on 5/23/2010, 2:18 am

All I can say is experience is very useful. Year two is way ahead on the learning curve than year one. And no matter what your experience something can still come out of left field and surprise you! You can see why farmers like anything that can guarantee a crop - growers always live on the edge.

That said, frost dates have quite a range. I looked at Post Falls, ID on weather.com and it shows historical data that shows at one time or another there has been a low of 32 or less all the way through June 18. Whereas average lows only show 32 degrees or less through April. So, anything can happen and it looks like you can't really count on it til June, but should be able to plant by April. Clear as mud?

In other words, it ain't you. the weather will do what it does and we just have to go with the flow. However, the fact that there are billions and billions of us shows that we have done a pretty good job of getting a handle on it.

Next year you will know to have the plastic covers at the ready - so it will probably be the warmest spring on record. LOL. Btw, May 22 in your area had a record high of 90 (1928) and a record low of 31 (1960), with the average being high 68 and low 44. For what it's worth.

In another post 1chichi posted the following:

Fun videos=
The set up.
http://weblogs.baltimoresun.com/features/gardening/2009/12/white_house_vegetable_garden_12.html
The results.
http://weblogs.baltimoresun.com/features/gardening/2010/04/white_house_vegetable_garden_u.html

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Re: Is there any hope?

Post  Megan on 5/23/2010, 4:51 am

mm, many of my plants are no bigger than those seedlings in your pictures. It is amazing how fast they grow. Go for it! Very Happy

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Re: Is there any hope?

Post  Lavender Debs on 5/23/2010, 10:02 am

Looks like you will be fine. The plants you mentioned planting out are all good with colder weather.

Your seedlings looked a little wet but you might have just watered before snapping a pic. I have time to take mine outside in the morning and bring them back in at night. It kept them from getting too (what did you call it? gangly? I like that). It also helped to harden them off. I am west of the Cascades so our weather is very different then Idaho. As cold as you are getting now, you will soon be hot, hot, hot and your tomatoes and peppers will take off while mine will shiver in our August sun.

I'll say it again.....nights need to be above 50 degrees to put out tomatoes. Even then, friends who have free-standing (your plastic) covers or walls-o-water get better tomatoes then I do.

Deborah....who sometimes thinks that if I stress so do my plants and dog. (Dog will try to dig up the object of stress not knowing that just stresses me more)

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Re: Is there any hope?

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