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Preorder.... decisions... and Questions

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Preorder.... decisions... and Questions

Post  ModernDayBetty on 7/10/2011, 12:03 am

I have tons of questions.... two on similar topic one not...

FIRST QUESTION: I am trying to decide what I should preorder. I started filling up my cart with garlic and then was shocked when I went to add shallots.

I have looked at several places for garlic and so far those who are now doing preorders Territorial Seed is the cheapest and it's local (score!). But I need help deciding what I should get. My wishlist is below, I'm thinking I should get 1 early, 1 mid, 1 late soft neck and one hard neck. Which is pretty much what I have it down to. Money is tight so I'm wondering, how much garlic am I going to get from 8 ozs? How many plants will that end up being? Suggestions?

List:
Belarus (hard)
Chesnok Red (hard)
Early Red Italian (soft)
Ichelium Red (soft)
Western Rose (soft)

SECOND QUESTION: I have only found shallots available for sale at Terrirtorial Seed. And I really wanted to do two, one that stored well and a few gray shallot that is suppose to be the envy of cooks in France. But at $20/lb it seems I would have too much and it would be an arm and a leg... Suggestions on where else to purchase these?

THIRD QUESTION: I have cabbage worms! Ugh. I have books telling me how to get rid of them. I have hand picked 1 tiny one and scrapped eggs off of leaves. I sprinkled corn meal all over everything in that bed. I wanted to make a garlic oil spray but I don't know where/how do you buy mineral oil. I'm not really sure if this is something I can pick up at a regular store or how it even comes (other than pre-made cosmetic stuff). So... Embarassed how do I buy it and where? (please don't tell me to just go get sven... bless you but no thank you Smile )

Thanks for any and all help/advice/opinions/information Very Happy
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Re: Preorder.... decisions... and Questions

Post  garden girl on 7/10/2011, 12:14 am

Hi Krazikandiland,

Sorry - I can only help you with question #3 - Mineral oil you can buy at a pharmacy. I think I got mine at Walmart. Mine is in a bottle about as big as rubbing alcohol. Sure hope you can rid of the little buggers. Good luck!

I'm also interested in buying some shallots - I'd like to try some to plant in the fall and harvest in spring. But I have no idea what that would be or if it would work in my area - mid-columbia, Washington, zone 5b. Hoping to get more information!

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Re: Preorder.... decisions... and Questions

Post  ModernDayBetty on 7/10/2011, 12:20 am

@garden girl wrote:Hi Krazikandiland,

Sorry - I can only help you with question #3 - Mineral oil you can buy at a pharmacy. I think I got mine at Walmart. Mine is in a bottle about as big as rubbing alcohol. Sure hope you can rid of the little buggers. Good luck!

I'm also interested in buying some shallots - I'd like to try some to plant in the fall and harvest in spring. But I have no idea what that would be or if it would work in my area - mid-columbia, Washington, zone 5b. Hoping to get more information!

Thanks for solving number 3!! You should be able to grow shallots/garlic. Territorial Seed gets there's from a farm in the Walla Walla, WA. :o) I assume that is close to you if your in the lower central area like me. There is also a farm up in the Okanogan that someone else posted about which has a climate that is very similar to us down here in summer but I think they have colder winters that grows garlic.
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Re: Preorder.... decisions... and Questions

Post  Nonna.PapaVino on 7/10/2011, 12:33 am

Krazi, It's almost impossible to tell you how much garlic you will harvest from your planting because there are way too many variables: weather, consistency of water, availability of nutrients, possibility of disease, etc. Also, the first year you plant a new-to-you garlic variety, its yield will be lower than subsequent years...it seems garlic likes a year or two to get used to its new surroundings (we assume you will save the largest cloves for next year's planting). If you are a heavy user of garlic in cooking, some things to consider: What does a head of garlic from your local grocery store cost (more or less than seed garlic that will at least quadruple at harvest? Is it local or was it grown in China (the world's largest producer of garlic, the quality of which varies)? How do you use garlic (baked for spreading on bread, etc.; in salsas; all-purpose as recipe requires)? So, considering the above, about how much garlic do you use in a year? Divide that into thirds and plant: an early-maturing variety to use through summer and early fall; a (possibly hardneck) variety that will supply you until around January; and a long-storing variety for use through spring. There will still be that stretch between about May and early July when even the longest-storing variety of garlic will be sprouting. Caution: Never plant ANY garlic that is not certified disease free. An ugly fungal disease that will turn your garlic into a stinky, ugly mess and survive in your soil for years and years awaiting another chance to ruin your harvest can be the result. In summation: buy the most seed garlic you can afford from the best grower possible, plant it, baby it, and harvest it, enjoy it...but save some for the following year, enough to expand your harvest each following year until you are satisfied with the kind and amount you end up with. Keep us informed as to how you do. Okay? Nonna

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Re: Preorder.... decisions... and Questions

Post  garden girl on 7/10/2011, 8:42 am

Caution: Never plant ANY garlic that is not certified disease free. An ugly fungal disease that will turn your garlic into a stinky, ugly mess and survive in your soil for years and years awaiting another chance to ruin your harvest can be the result.

*****

So... if you buy certified garlic to start with, then use some of that for re-planting the next year, it will still be disease free? If I have bulbs from the grocery store that begin to sprout, would they be safe ( I hope so, since I've been eatin' them)? I usually get mine all used up, but sometimes it sprouts and I've always wondered if it could be planted.

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Re: Preorder.... decisions... and Questions

Post  Nonna.PapaVino on 7/10/2011, 9:24 am

Garden girl, here's a site with brief overview of garlic diseases: http://www.garlic-central.com/disease.html A quick read of it will give you what I know about it. We were struck with the white rot is what hit us, and now almost the entire north garden is off limits for garlic planting. With certified seed garlic, and careful preparation of the cloves, I think you can save some of your crop for planting next year. See the quoted post below:

Shannon1 posted in the Gulf Coast Garlic? thread this quote from Gourmet Garlic Gardening site: "When your soil is fully ready to be planted, take the bulbs you want to plant and break them apart into their individual cloves (Being sure to keep each variety separate from others). Soak each varieties' cloves in water containing one heaping tablespoon of bicarbonate of soda (baking soda) and liquid seaweed per gallon to protect them from fungus as well as give them an energy boost. Leave the cloves in the soda water overnight for 16 to 24 hours or long enough for the clove covers to loosen so the liquid comes into contact with the surfaces of the cloves and the clove covers loosen up so that the cloves can easily be extracted without damaging them.
Garlic's clove covers can contain fungal spores, or conidia or the eggs of pests such as mites and are best discarded rather than planted since the first thing the cloves do is to shed them, anyway. The baking soda helps neutralize the fungi. Commercial growers don't usually have time to peel cloves bare but they need to find an economical way to do it because garlic diseases or pests can put them out of business. Gardeners have the time and and should peel the clove covers off. "

Hope this helps. Nonna

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Re: Preorder.... decisions... and Questions

Post  ModernDayBetty on 7/10/2011, 6:56 pm

Thanks for the help. I have narrowed it down to getting potato onions
and shallots through www.southernexposure.com and garlic through
www.filareefarm.com. I got it down to about 1/2 of what I was looking at
spending before. I have 1/2 as much garlic but the same variety and I
have a better mix of onions and shallots and I think more by the lb. I
am not sure how early I need to order... I'm still thinking it over. I'm
at $70 before shipping and tax and that seems like a lot of money to
spend. So if anyone else has any other website ordering place please let
me know.

Oh and Nonna.PapaVino Thank you so much for that garlic info, I had no idea!! :o) I planted one clove in spring just to see what would happen so I hope I didn't cause any problems with my soil. But at least if I did I now know what it is. :o)
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Re: Preorder.... decisions... and Questions

Post  Nonna.PapaVino on 7/10/2011, 8:04 pm

Krazi, planting in spring won't give you a large head of garlic like fall-planting will, but you WILL be able to assess its viability in your area. If, heaven forbid, you dig up the garlic in early July, and find it has a nasty chemical smell and some wet, fuzzy material around the cloves, you have THE DISEASE (either white rot or one of the other nasties). If the head looks clean, and the cloves smell like, well, like garlic! you're probably okay, so cook it up and enjoy. For next year, I'd definitately spend a bit more and get certified seed garlic. My mistake a couple of years ago was planting a head from the garlic purchased at a farmer's market. Should have eaten it, not planted it. Those fungal spores will hunker down and live in your soil for decades. Having said that, if you establish a new raised bed with a new batch of Mel's Mix in it, and use certified garlic, there should be no problem with raising the garlic one year, eating 75 percent of it and planting (in clean soil) 25 percent for the upcoming year. Just be sure the variety you choose to propagate year to year is one you really, really love--makes it personal, you know. We have three varieties we prefer, but always order at least one new variety just to be sure what we have is still a favorite, or, is it time to say goodbye to it. Enjoy the culinary adventure you're embarking on. Nonna

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Re: Preorder.... decisions... and Questions

Post  UnderTheBlackWalnut on 7/11/2011, 2:06 pm

There is another thread going on at the same time about garlic and some of the posters are referencing a site where you can buy garlic by the bulb rather than by the pound....check it out:

Garlic Thread
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