Square Foot Gardening Forum

Hello Guest!
Welcome to the official Square Foot Gardening Forum.
There's lots to learn here by reading as a guest. However, if you become a member (it's free, ad free and spam-free) you'll have access to our large vermiculite databases, our seed exchange spreadsheets, Mel's Mix calculator, and many more members' pictures in the Gallery. Enjoy.


Search
 
 

Display results as :
 


Rechercher Advanced Search

Latest topics
» Measuring organic content
by GreenGene Today at 7:25 pm

» Skin reaction to Squash
by boffer Today at 7:20 pm

» Squash question
by boffer Today at 6:22 pm

» Northern California & Coastal Valleys - What are you doing this month?
by Marc Iverson Today at 5:16 pm

» Weck jars
by sanderson Today at 5:06 pm

» Mother Earth News Fair 2014
by sfg4uKim Today at 4:23 pm

» What I've learned this year
by herblover Today at 2:45 pm

» 2014 Tomatoes
by CapeCoddess Today at 2:43 pm

» What are you eating from your garden today?
by sanderson Today at 1:57 pm

» Mid-At Sep 2014 - How's your fall garden going?
by CapeCoddess Today at 1:15 pm

» Cement blocks for SFG
by sfg4uKim Today at 8:04 am

» PNW: September 2014
by Marc Iverson Yesterday at 11:14 pm

» New England September 2014
by jimmy cee Yesterday at 9:27 pm

» fall planting
by Eric Lingo Yesterday at 7:09 pm

» Truth or Myth? Garden Lore Explored
by Marc Iverson Yesterday at 5:49 pm

» 25 Free Project Plans Book
by AtlantaMarie Yesterday at 11:23 am

» Spaghetti Squash & Golden Bantam Corn
by AtlantaMarie Yesterday at 11:20 am

» Why blanch veggies?
by AtlantaMarie Yesterday at 11:18 am

» My rapini is scaring me
by Marc Iverson Yesterday at 3:54 am

» Compost: Bekeley 18 day [hot] method
by sanderson Yesterday at 2:47 am

» BT availability?
by TCgardening 9/14/2014, 7:49 pm

» what to plant and not to plant
by camprn 9/14/2014, 6:50 pm

» Pounds per square foot?
by Mikesgardn 9/14/2014, 12:20 pm

» 2014 SFG in Brooks, GA
by yolos 9/14/2014, 11:57 am

» Hi from Punta Gorda, FL!
by HLMullaney 9/14/2014, 10:24 am

» Table toppers - support questions
by ralitaco 9/14/2014, 9:18 am

» Business member new to SFG Community!
by FeedMeSeeMore 9/14/2014, 9:13 am

» don't touch this catapiller
by FeedMeSeeMore 9/14/2014, 9:05 am

» Better Late than Never
by ralitaco 9/13/2014, 9:50 pm

» Name That Mystery Critter
by camprn 9/13/2014, 4:13 pm

Google

Search SFG Forum

dry beans for square foot gardening?

Page 1 of 2 1, 2  Next

View previous topic View next topic Go down

dry beans for square foot gardening?

Post  Feistywidget on 10/30/2011, 4:43 pm

I made a post about growing dry beans for container gardening. Is it even possible to get a good yield of dry beans using the SFG gardening method, or is it impossible and not practical?

It was suggested to me that if I was going to do this, I should use vertical gardening; however I've no clue what vertical gardening is, nor do I know how to implement it. The definition of vertical gardening and how to implement it, I would greatly appreciate information on both.

The varieties of beans I'd like to grow for dry beans are listed below (the types as well as the names of the seed varieties themselves)

*Cannellini (white kidney)
*Kidney Bean (dark red kidney bean)
*Pinto (Painted Pinto Bean)
*Black (Black Turtle or Valentine)
*Chickpea/Garbanzo

*Lima Bean (Fordhook 242 Bush)

*Azuki Bean (Azuki bean is an Asian red bean; it's commonly used in a ton of asian desserts; the dry bean is made into a sweet bean paste) (Late Tamba)

*Edamame (a Japanese green soy bean) (Early Hakucho)
*Cowpeas (California Blackeye)
*Cranberry Bean (Cranberry bush dry bean)


The one other thing I have a question about is converting conventional plot gardening numbers into how many plants this is the equivalent of with SFG.


Here is an example:

A person wants to grow 50 lbs of dry beans. They wanted to know how much space they would need to grow that amount of dry beans. A farmer told them 1220 feet.

With the 1220 feet, how many plants is the equivalent of this? I mean with container gardening, giving me information like that makes absolutely no sense. I need to know the quantity of plants that would be the equivalent of the measurement given.

They also recommended the use of pole beans for dry beans in square foot gardening.

Feistywidget

Posts: 53
Join date: 2011-10-01
Location: Boyne City Michigan (gardening zone 5; short growing season....mild and cool climate...hot summers, but much milder than summers in tropical gardening zones)

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: dry beans for square foot gardening?

Post  Lavender Debs on 10/30/2011, 5:35 pm

I tried a few new protein plants. Fava Beans in spring and both Garbanzo Beans and Cranberry Beans.

I've never had Fava Beans before this year. They are fabulous! I did not think to measure how much I got from the Fava's. From 4 squares we had about 4 meals. I'll plant them again.

I live in Western Washington. Our season is short. Black Garbanzo beans might have had a chance in a better season. June and July were cold and wet here. The heat of August did not last long enough to finish the garbanzos. I may try again next year. Of 4 squares planted only one plant made it to September.

The best dry bean was a local heirloom cranberry bean known as Rockwell. It made a beautiful harvest of beans. I only put in one square of Rockwells (9 seeds) which yielded 4 and 1/2 ounces. Apparently that would be 3 squares to yeild a bit over a pound of beans (you do the rest of the math.)

I will plant a lot more Rockwells next year, but not 50 pounds worth!


Lavender Debs

Posts: 2018
Join date: 2010-03-03
Age: 57
Location: Everett, WA USA

View user profile http://songs-of-coming-rain.blogspot.com/

Back to top Go down

Re: dry beans for square foot gardening?

Post  boffer on 10/30/2011, 5:39 pm

Vertical gardening means growing your plants up trellises. You can get a greater yield per space used. You'll find a lot of information about vertical gardening in the ALL NEW SFG book.

To convert to planting in a square, use the spacing for seed planting in a row.
For instance, if you're instructed to plant a seed every 4 inches in a row, then you would plant 9 seeds per square. Here's a simple chart to get you started:

1 every 12 inches: 1 per sf
1 every 6 inches: 4 per sf
1 every 4 inches: 9 per sf
1 every 3 inches: 16 per sf

More information about spacing can be found in the book.





____________________________

Last frost date (50%): April 15     First frost date (50%): Oct 15    
Zone: Irrelevant

boffer

Male Posts: 6333
Join date: 2010-02-26
Age: 61
Location: yelm, wa, usa

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: dry beans for square foot gardening?

Post  Chopper on 10/30/2011, 7:08 pm

This is the reference I use. And for more about vertical gardening see the book.



Here are
examples of what can be planted in each square foot:
16 carrots or radishes, onion (or 9)
9 onions,
beets, peas, garlic, spinach. bush beans, pole beans
4 lettuce, chard, marigolds, or kohlrabi, strawberries,
1 tomato, pepper(try 2 next time), eggplant, broccoli, cabbage, or corn,
cabbage, celery, potato
1 squash, or melon per 2 sq.ft. (or 3ft space – zucchini)
2 cucumbers
-or-



1 per square
foot: plants that are thinned or planted 12 inches apart.


4 per square
foot: plants that are thinned or planted 6 inches apart.


9 per square
foot: plants that are thinned or planted 4 inches apart.


16 per
square foot: plants that are thinned or planted 3 inches apart.
Vertical gardening is what pole beans have always done - grow vertically. Most people create a PVC or other frame and put nylon netting on it. That is what I use on the north side of several of my boxes.

For your purposes and volume you will have to have quite a few boxes, but it should be easy enough to do. Are you the one who eats only from their garden? If so, you would expect to have to have quite a few boxes anyway. It is certainly doable in an SFG and I would not want to do it any other way. Just plan for volume.

And if you plant 1220 feet at three seeds per foot the it is 3660 seeds. At 9 seeds per sf in SFG that is 406 squares. And that is how I would figure it.



Here is a pic of a very simple vertical structure.


There are a dozen different ways to do it, I am sure you can think of something practical for your uses.

Chopper

Female Posts: 2460
Join date: 2010-05-05
Age: 59
Location: Warner Springs, CA Sunset Zone 7

View user profile http://thezimmermannfamilytoo.blogspot.com

Back to top Go down

Re: dry beans for square foot gardening?

Post  Too Tall Tomatoes on 10/30/2011, 9:22 pm

hey Chopper, is that white fence around that box for decorative purposes or are they there to keep out rabbits and such?

Too Tall Tomatoes

Male Posts: 1069
Join date: 2011-10-24
Age: 44
Location: Pennsylvania, Zone 6A

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: dry beans for square foot gardening?

Post  Cincinnati on 10/30/2011, 10:09 pm

Chopper wrote:... Just plan for volume.

And if you plant 1220 feet at three seeds per foot the it is 3660 seeds. At 9 seeds per sf in SFG that is 406 squares.

Whoa! You need a box 4ft wide by just over 100ft long. That's 200 cu ft of mel's mix just to grow dried beans. Them thar beans are going to be expensive.

OK, I just realized I overlooked that this is a hypothetical scenario. Since I'm this far into a reply: My solution would be to get that in two growing seasons per year. That essentially cuts the space in half.

This example does show you have to be serious about gardening to feed a family of 5 for the entire year. Without doing extensive calculations, I can see that 50 boxes or more could easily be required to eliminate purchasing from the grocery.

Cincinnati

Posts: 181
Join date: 2011-06-26
Location: Alabama Gulf Coast

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: dry beans for square foot gardening?

Post  littlejo on 10/31/2011, 12:20 am

Can you eat the green part of a dry bean plant? If you can, then you could take the green part and make french style green beans, and set the seeds aside to dry, making 2 crops at once.

cinncinati: I have 8 4x8 beds and have bought nothing but some lettuce in the hottest part of the summer and fed 2 folks all we could eat and put some up for winter. I saved lots from having the SFG. I've never tried dried beans, but to get organic, I guess I'll have to try next yr.

littlejo

Female Posts: 1414
Join date: 2011-05-04
Age: 60
Location: Cottageville SC 8b

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: dry beans for square foot gardening?

Post  Cincinnati on 10/31/2011, 9:12 am

littlejo wrote:Can you eat the green part of a dry bean plant? If you can, then you could take the green part and make french style green beans, and set the seeds aside to dry, making 2 crops at once.

cinncinati: I have 8 4x8 beds and have bought nothing but some lettuce in the hottest part of the summer and fed 2 folks all we could eat and put some up for winter. I saved lots from having the SFG. I've never tried dried beans, but to get organic, I guess I'll have to try next yr.

littlejo, I have never heard that the bean plant itself is edible. Although the very young bean plant (as a sprout) is edible. Or are you speaking about the pods?

Congrats on your SQFT 8! (or maybe SQ 8! —Hey, that just became my new name for a homemade garden soup — and/or vegetable drink). How many months of food for 2 did you get from those 8 beds? How much did you put up? Did you can, dehydrate, or freeze?

I have a family of 5 and I want to get to a point of having enough garden to feed us for the year, running out about the time the new garden is ready. I have an added benefit of having several growing seasons a year here in lower Alabama.

Cincinnati

Posts: 181
Join date: 2011-06-26
Location: Alabama Gulf Coast

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: dry beans for square foot gardening?

Post  Feistywidget on 10/31/2011, 7:08 pm

NOTE: With the numerical aspect of this, I'm horrible with math, so I could really use help with that aspect, ESPECIALLY with how many seeds I need to plant to get a yield of 25 lbs. of dry beans.

Well for starters, with growing the dry beans, it would just be for myself. How many pounds of dry beans (by weight) would be sufficient? I realize this is really subjective, as it depends on how often you eat beans. I could really use guidelines as to how many lbs. of dry beans to plant per person; like I said, it would just be for myself.

I found this on a site that it recommended for a year's worth of dry beans, you should have 60 lbs. per person. However this is under the assumption that you eat beans everyday. Although they're a staple in my diet, I don't eat them daily.

If you're going to plant 60 lbs. worth of dry beans, well how much would you plant? I know how much to plant for 50 lbs. of dry beans, but how many squares would you need, and how many seeds for 10 lbs. of dry beans? As I said before, I'm extremely bad with math.

However is this just under the assumption that it's if you eat beans everyday? Because while beans are a staple in my diet, I don't eat them all the time.

The ones I'd use the most out of the list I gave are the black beans, azuki (Asian red bean), cranberry, cannellini and edamame (green soy bean).


I'd like to be able to plant enough seeds to get 25 lbs. of dry beans of the varieties listed above.

Now according to what you said with how much you have to plant to get 50 lbs. of dry beans......


And if you plant 1220 feet at three seeds per foot the it is 3660 seeds. At 9 seeds per sf in SFG that is 406 squares.

I'm assuming for 25 pounds of dry beans you would need in a conventional plot 610 feet. With square foot gardening that translates out to 203 squares, and you'd need
and 1830. With all of the figures given for what I gave with how much you'd need to plant with dry beans (how many seeds, and how many squares) is my math correct?

Mind you this is all hypothetical.

The other question I had is the the figures you gave for how many seeds you'd need to plant for 50 lbs. of dry beans, is this for pole beans?

Is it really just more practical to get a good yield of dry beans to use vertical gardening combined with growing pole beans as opposed to growing bush bean varieties for dry beans?

The other question I had is in order to get 25 lbs. of dry beans well with seeds, are you going to have to plant twice as many seeds to get that yield? Basically, if I want my yield to be 25 lbs. of dry beans, then would I have to plant 50 lbs. worth of dry beans with the seeds?

That is, 3660 seeds planted even though I only need 25 lbs. of dry beans? I honestly don't know, I am extremely bad with math, so I could use clarification with this.

Feistywidget

Posts: 53
Join date: 2011-10-01
Location: Boyne City Michigan (gardening zone 5; short growing season....mild and cool climate...hot summers, but much milder than summers in tropical gardening zones)

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: dry beans for square foot gardening?

Post  littlejo on 10/31/2011, 8:22 pm

I really don't think bush beans put on as much as they claim. I tried this with regular green beans and will plant pole style from now on. As far as how much to plant, I would only plant 2 squares deep with something (trelllis or fence)to grow on. I don't do math very well either, so at 9 per square, 2 deep in an 8 ft bed, 144 plants per bed. I would guess that each plant would produce 4 to 6 ounces per plant, dry. That's 36 pounds if they put on 4 ounces dried. That seems like a lot, but in order to get them to produce good, you would have to pick a little along until the plants start producing well, then let them mature and be ready to dry.


I got interested about the dry beans, since I am begining to want only organic. My hubby and I feel better this year and part of it may be the lower pesticide residue on our food.
I googled them and pintos can be used like green bean before they are dried. Cranberry beans(if you can locate any, none in stores here) can be grown and will produce beans in a pot in the house. I like the flavor of cranberry beans. I will put my garden results in another thread in a minute. Jo

littlejo

Female Posts: 1414
Join date: 2011-05-04
Age: 60
Location: Cottageville SC 8b

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: dry beans for square foot gardening?

Post  Chopper on 10/31/2011, 8:58 pm

Too Tall Tomatoes wrote:hey Chopper, is that white fence around that box for decorative purposes or are they there to keep out rabbits and such?

It was for dogs. They could get over it, but usually they didn't.

Chopper

Female Posts: 2460
Join date: 2010-05-05
Age: 59
Location: Warner Springs, CA Sunset Zone 7

View user profile http://thezimmermannfamilytoo.blogspot.com

Back to top Go down

Re: dry beans for square foot gardening?

Post  Chopper on 10/31/2011, 9:06 pm

Feistywidget wrote:ESPECIALLY with how many seeds I need to plant to get a yield of 25 lbs. of dry beans.

You gave constant that a 1220 foot row would yeild 50 pounds of beans. Whether bush or pole I do not know. You'd have to ask the farmer again.

Bush beans were developed for uniform and easy harvest so for your purposes I would go for bush.

That said, you do not get a lot of bang for your buck with dried beans. That is why few people do them in a home garden. But if you are determined and you want to do this then here you go - accept and go with it. As time goes on you will discover whether you need more or less.

Per your numbers and for 25 pounds of beans then you would need 203 squares.

203 squares/16 (number of squares in a standard 4X4 box) = 12.68 or say 13 boxes. Not horrible if you have the room. If you are using 4X8 foot boxes then it would be 7 boxes if you round up. So there is your answer. You need thirteen 4X4 boxes of bush beans to get 25 pounds. So 50 pounds is 26 boxes and 60 pounds you have to figure out yourself. (hint - about 5 boxes per 10 pounds)

Now you know what you are looking at. If you have the room, it should be no problem.


OK, so now yyou know that for 25 pounds you need 203 squares. You plant 9 plants per square so 9*203= 1827. And that is assuming they all germinate and none are eaten by snails (ask me why I mention that...). So figure 2000 seeds per 25 pounds or 800 seeds per 10 pounds of dried beans.

Chopper

Female Posts: 2460
Join date: 2010-05-05
Age: 59
Location: Warner Springs, CA Sunset Zone 7

View user profile http://thezimmermannfamilytoo.blogspot.com

Back to top Go down

Re: dry beans for square foot gardening?

Post  Cincinnati on 11/1/2011, 2:06 am

Feistywidget wrote:ESPECIALLY with how many seeds I need to plant to get a yield of 25 lbs. of dry beans.
We have gotten way off base on our assumptions and calculations.

Chopper wrote:You gave constant that a 1220 foot row would yield 50 pounds of beans.

...Per your numbers and for 25 pounds of beans (Harvested) then you would need 203 squares.

...or say 13 boxes. ...You need thirteen 4X4 boxes of bush beans to get 25 pounds. So 50 pounds is 26 boxes...

...You plant 9 plants per square so 9*203= 1827 (beans or plants).

... figure 2000 seeds per 25 pounds or 800 seeds per 10 pounds of dried beans.

I challenge the assumption that a 1220 foot row is required to harvest 50# of dried beans. Not that I remember how much produce I got from my bush beans. But the numbers in the squares don't compute.

If 1827 plants produce only 25# of beans, that is only a mere 0.014 pounds/plant or .22 ounces harvested per entire bean plant.

I am going to speculate now: I remember getting a dozen (maybe up to two dozen) pods per plant and 6-8 beans per pod minimum. So 1 plant easily generates about 100 beans — which is a 100:1 yield by count. So for every pound of beans planted you would get 100# of harvest.

Therefore, to harvest 25# of beans you'd plant about 0.25 pounds. If I would only get 50 beans per plant, that is a 50:1 yield or 1/2 pound of seed to harvest 25# of beans.

WHEW!

SO I recommend that you weigh out 1/4 pound of dried beans and count them. I think you'd be better off estimating how many pods per plant and number of beans per pod to estimate your yield than to use the assumption that you need a 1220 ft row to harvest 50# of dried beans.

Cincinnati

Posts: 181
Join date: 2011-06-26
Location: Alabama Gulf Coast

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: dry beans for square foot gardening?

Post  Kelejan on 11/1/2011, 2:57 am

Reading this thread, my mind is spinning with all the figures. Seems to me that producing these beans is going to be very expensive to set up all these beds just to produce dried beans.

What I suggest is plant one 4x4 box with beans, look after them, then at the end of the season weigh how many pounds you have produced for the cost of the seeds you planted. Compare that with buying that amount in the store.

Kelejan

Female Posts: 1774
Join date: 2011-04-24
Age: 79
Location: Castlegar, British Columbia

View user profile http://www.castlegarinkspot.ca

Back to top Go down

Re: dry beans for square foot gardening?

Post  Chopper on 11/1/2011, 6:08 am

Cincinnati wrote:
I challenge the assumption that a 1220 foot row is required to harvest 50# of dried beans.

That was a quote given to him by a farmer and everything I figured came from that assumption, which I have no idea if it correct or not. I stand by my figures based on that original constant.

Chopper

Female Posts: 2460
Join date: 2010-05-05
Age: 59
Location: Warner Springs, CA Sunset Zone 7

View user profile http://thezimmermannfamilytoo.blogspot.com

Back to top Go down

Re: dry beans for square foot gardening?

Post  Icemaiden on 11/1/2011, 6:18 am

Chopper wrote: I stand by my figures based on that original constant.

Should the 203 be 208?

Icemaiden

Posts: 334
Join date: 2010-04-27
Location: Iceland

View user profile http://squarefootgardening-kate.blogspot.com/

Back to top Go down

Page 1 of 2 1, 2  Next

View previous topic View next topic Back to top


Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum