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New & overwhelmed with getting started

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New & overwhelmed with getting started

Post  clthames on 1/12/2012, 4:48 pm

Greetings! Although I grew up helping in the family garden, I haven't gardened for over 20 years. I bought and read ANSFG last fall in preparation for a garden this year. I wish I had started preparing then, as I think I could have some of my own compost to use by now.

Anyway, I am planning now to put in a garden this spring. Right now I am focused on building the beds. . . that part I can handle.

Deciding where to place the beds is another story. What site characteristics should I look for? Since it is winter I don't really know WHERE on my property the sun will be best during the spring/summer. Is there a way to do a best guess?

And then there is the Mels Mix. Is it too late to start building my own compost? Or does anyone in East or Central Texas have recommendations for finding GOOD compost? I don't mind driving a ways to get something I can rely on. Being a total beginner I don't want to rely on my ability to inspect compost and know if it is good or not.

Last question (for now) . . . when should I plan to start putting plants in the ground? I have seeds but decided at least for year one that I will find a good source of starter plants and wait until I have a year behind me before trying to start seeds indoors as well.

Thanks in advance for your help!
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Re: New & overwhelmed with getting started

Post  madnicmom on 1/12/2012, 5:11 pm

Just browsing your region , I found this for you.

The Lower South has
two distinct growing seasons, Spring and Fall. Summers are too hot for
gardens and winters are too cold. (there are exceptions, okra survives
summers and plants like kale survive the winter).



what are you wanting to grow first?

edited to add: http://davesgarden.com/guides/freeze-frost-dates/ put in your zip code and copy and paste what it gives you. We can better help you plan your garden.

Do you know your north/south sides of your property?
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Re: New & overwhelmed with getting started

Post  clthames on 1/12/2012, 5:39 pm

@madnicmom wrote:what are you wanting to grow first?

edited to add: put in your zip code and copy and paste what it gives you. We can better help you plan your garden.

Do you know your north/south sides of your property?

There are alot of things we WANT to grow but I don't want to overwhelm us . . . . so we will probably start with some of these: tomatoes, cherry tomatoes, summer squash, lettuce and greens, onion, potatoes, cucumbers, peppers.

Yes, I know the north/south sides of the property.

Here is the pasted information:

Each winter, on average, your risk of frost is from November 11 through March 22.
Almost certainly, however, you will receive frost from November 29 through March 2.
You are almost guaranteed that you will not get frost from April 11 through October 25.
Your frost-free growing season is around 234 days.

Mt Vernon, TX (Franklin county):



Temperature10%20%30%40%50%60%70%80%90%
Spring 32° Apr 11 Apr 4 Mar 30 Mar 26 Mar 22 Mar 18 Mar 14 Mar 9 Mar 2
Spring 28° Mar 25 Mar 18 Mar 12 Mar 8 Mar 4 Feb 28 Feb 24 Feb 18 Feb 11
Spring 24° Mar 17 Mar 8 Mar 2 Feb 25 Feb 20 Feb 15 Feb 9 Feb 3 Jan 25
Fall 32° Oct 25 Oct 31 Nov 4 Nov 8 Nov 11 Nov 15 Nov 18 Nov 23 Nov 29
Fall 28° Nov 5 Nov 12 Nov 17 Nov 22 Nov 26 Dec 1 Dec 5 Dec 10 Dec 18
Fall 24° Nov 11 Nov 20 Nov 27 Dec 4 Dec 10 Dec 15 Dec 21 Dec 28 Jan 6
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Re: New & overwhelmed with getting started

Post  camprn on 1/12/2012, 6:07 pm

to the SFG Forum? How many are there in your family? I know this always comes into play whilst I am planning my garden.

____________________________

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http://squarefoot.creatingforum.com/t3574-the-end-of-july-7-weeks-until-frost

There are certain pursuits which, if not wholly poetic and true, do at least suggest a nobler and finer relation to nature than we know. The keeping of bees, for instance. ~ Henry David Thoreau

http://squarefoot.creatingforum.com/t1306-other-gardening-books



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Re: New & overwhelmed with getting started

Post  madnicmom on 1/12/2012, 6:12 pm

@clthames wrote:
@madnicmom wrote:

Do you know your north/south sides of your property?

There are alot of things we WANT to grow but I don't want to overwhelm us . . . . so we will probably start with some of these: tomatoes, cherry tomatoes, summer squash, lettuce and greens, onion, potatoes, cucumbers, peppers.

Yes, I know the north/south sides of the property.

Here is the pasted information:

Each winter, on average, your risk of frost is from November 11 through March 22.
Almost certainly, however, you will receive frost from November 29 through March 2.
You are almost guaranteed that you will not get frost from April 11 through October 25.
Your frost-free growing season is around 234 days.

Mt Vernon, TX (Franklin county):



Temperature10%20%30%40%50%60%70%80%90%
Spring 32°Apr 11Apr 4Mar 30Mar 26Mar 22Mar 18Mar 14Mar 9Mar 2
Spring 28°Mar 25Mar 18Mar 12Mar 8Mar 4Feb 28Feb 24Feb 18Feb 11
Spring 24°Mar 17Mar 8Mar 2Feb 25Feb 20Feb 15Feb 9Feb 3Jan 25
Fall 32°Oct 25Oct 31Nov 4Nov 8Nov 11Nov 15Nov 18Nov 23Nov 29
Fall 28°Nov 5Nov 12Nov 17Nov 22Nov 26Dec 1Dec 5Dec 10Dec 18
Fall 24°Nov 11Nov 20Nov 27Dec 4Dec 10Dec 15Dec 21Dec 28Jan 6

Lettuce and greens will go in the ground first. Depending on the variety, Look on the package. I would use March 2nd as your last spring frost. So count back in weeks how many it saids and plant those. I would use April 11 as your first day for all the other veggies. They are your summer plants. Plant those as close to that date as possible or when you harvest the lettuces/greens (after 04/11/12)

Have I confused you? I'm trying to simplify it for you.
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Re: New & overwhelmed with getting started

Post  clthames on 1/12/2012, 6:16 pm

@camprn wrote: to the SFG Forum? How many are there in your family? I know this always comes into play whilst I am planning my garden.

There's 3 of us living at home now. But we typically feed 4-5.
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Re: New & overwhelmed with getting started

Post  clthames on 1/12/2012, 6:26 pm

@madnicmom wrote:
Lettuce and greens will go in the ground first. Depending on the variety, Look on the package. I would use March 2nd as your last spring frost. So count back in weeks how many it saids and plant those. I would use April 11 as your first day for all the other veggies. They are your summer plants. Plant those as close to that date as possible or when you harvest the lettuces/greens (after 04/11/12)

Have I confused you? I'm trying to simplify it for you.

So, my package of collard greens says plant indoors 8 weeks before last frost and transplant 2-4 weeks before last frost. Now . . . I'm going to bypass planing indoors this time just to keep things simple. So I will buy and plant collard greens 2-4 weeks before March 2nd (assuming the plants have the same planting dates as my seeds)??????

So I have several weeks before being able to plant anything. Other than building my beds (project for next weekend), what should I be working on right now?
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Re: New & overwhelmed with getting started

Post  Unmutual on 1/12/2012, 6:32 pm

Your local extension office and Master Gardeners will be more than happy to help you. Here are some links to extension office material for your area.

Planting Guide Basically, how to garden in Texas.

What Varieties to choose This shows you what varieties are known to grow in your area. Using the listed varieties will increase your chance of success. This list is important when you are starting out. Some local nurseries will sell things that don't necessarily grow well. It's not their fault per se, it's usually because a lot of people ask for them.

If you follow that information, you shouldn't go wrong. You can ignore the fertilizer requirements because you don't need any if you made your Mel's Mix correctly(though by reading it, you can also see how smart you were by choosing SFG and how much work you saved yourself!). As you get used to things, you will find out what other things pertain to SFG and what doesn't(such as fertilizer).

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Re: New & overwhelmed with getting started

Post  madnicmom on 1/12/2012, 6:41 pm

some cucumbers and squash are vines. After getting your beds constructed/placement determined and Mel's Mix made, look into trellis material.

You received some good info about gardening in Texas. thank you Unmutual.
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Re: New & overwhelmed with getting started

Post  Ha-v-v on 1/12/2012, 6:51 pm

Welcome to the forum !! Very Happy
You will do great and be able to share tons Im sure Smile
If you dont already know your hardiness zone, here is a link to a spot to find out.
http://www.garden.org/zipzone/
I know finding out my zone helped me tons.


I love all the suggestions already put in, lots of things to check out to start. The folks on this forum are totally amazing. praise

Ha-v-v
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One step at a time

Post  tomperrin on 1/12/2012, 8:11 pm

First, not to worry. Mel's book lays it all out for you. Build the box, make Mel's Mix, fill the box, transplant seedlings or plant seeds. Build some kind of enclosure so critters don't feed on your hard work. Water regularly. Put a chair and an umbrella in your garden so you can meditate and watch your plants grow. But above all, make mistakes. (just make small ones).

Here are some of my mistakes:


  • Didn't keep records, or mark what I planted where. Forgot what and where I planted. Ended up planting lettuce and carrots in the same place.
  • Couldn't keep the proper portions of Mel's Mix in my head, and so put in too much of one ingredient than the other. (I posted something on making Mel's Mix last summer that might be helpful. Just search my posts and find the earliest one or two).
  • Used wrong size boards. Bigger (7") turned out to be better.
  • Got sick and neglected the garden for a month.
  • Lost track of my costs and didn't make penny pinching choices. But hey, I had fun.
  • Didn't find a great nursey until late in the planting season.
  • Relied too much on big box stores. Should have shopped the independents, picked brains and compared prices.

One thing I did right. I cancelled a planned purchase of a roto-tiller. That cancellation alone has subsidized my mistakes well into the next decade.

Irritations:


  • Bending over and planting small seeds.
  • Recognizing that I have spent a lifetime eating the wrong foods. (Gotta let go of that one!)

Benefits:


  • Lost 20 lbs building the fence and making dirt.
  • Found that just sitting in the garden and meditating lowered my blood pressure.
  • Confounded my doctors over my improved health. (Diabetes, Heart).
  • Discovered wonderful flavors I never knew existed from organically grown veggies.
  • Learned to forgive myself and grow from my mistakes.

BTW, my family thought I was nuts when I started this project. But they enjoyed the food we grew. They still think I'm nuts, but at least they now keep quiet about it.

Have fun!

Tom
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Re: New & overwhelmed with getting started

Post  TejasTerry on 1/12/2012, 9:36 pm

I am new to this myself, and am in South Texas.

So I've been watching the Sun during the day to see where on my property I will most likely get 6 to 8 hours of sun light. I had to take out a few trees to create this spot. I will be able to get (3) 4 x 8 boxes built in this area. I know the sun will be higher in the sky during the Spring and summer, so I should be ok.

I have visited several local garden centers, and found sources for my coarse vermiculite and the 5 different types of manure. I also checked out Craigslist, and found a guy close to me with a llama farm who was selling llama manure. When I went to buy it, he actually gave me most of it for free. I've also found a local source for worm castings at a cheaper price than ordering online.

I hope this gives you some ideas on where to start...As I said, I'm also a newbie, and am going thru what you are....but maybe gave you a few ideas that I've come up with.
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Re: New & overwhelmed with getting started

Post  clthames on 1/12/2012, 10:28 pm

@tomperrin wrote:First, not to worry. Mel's book lays it all out for you. Build the box, make Mel's Mix, fill the box, transplant seedlings or plant seeds. Build some kind of enclosure so critters don't feed on your hard work. Water regularly. Put a chair and an umbrella in your garden so you can meditate and watch your plants grow. But above all, make mistakes. (just make small ones).

Here are some of my mistakes:


  • Didn't keep records, or mark what I planted where. Forgot what and where I planted. Ended up planting lettuce and carrots in the same place.
  • Couldn't keep the proper portions of Mel's Mix in my head, and so put in too much of one ingredient than the other. (I posted something on making Mel's Mix last summer that might be helpful. Just search my posts and find the earliest one or two).
  • Used wrong size boards. Bigger (7") turned out to be better.
  • Got sick and neglected the garden for a month.
  • Lost track of my costs and didn't make penny pinching choices. But hey, I had fun.
  • Didn't find a great nursey until late in the planting season.
  • Relied too much on big box stores. Should have shopped the independents, picked brains and compared prices.

One thing I did right. I cancelled a planned purchase of a roto-tiller. That cancellation alone has subsidized my mistakes well into the next decade.

Irritations:


  • Bending over and planting small seeds.
  • Recognizing that I have spent a lifetime eating the wrong foods. (Gotta let go of that one!)

Benefits:


  • Lost 20 lbs building the fence and making dirt.
  • Found that just sitting in the garden and meditating lowered my blood pressure.
  • Confounded my doctors over my improved health. (Diabetes, Heart).
  • Discovered wonderful flavors I never knew existed from organically grown veggies.
  • Learned to forgive myself and grow from my mistakes.

BTW, my family thought I was nuts when I started this project. But they enjoyed the food we grew. They still think I'm nuts, but at least they now keep quiet about it.

Have fun!

Tom

WOW . . . what an inspiration. Thank you so much for the encouragement. I have been looking forward to this for a couple of years . . . but until now we've spent most of the summer months traveling so my daughter could play basketball. She's graduating in May so we'll finally be able to start building our homestead . . . . starting with my gardens for fresh eating and canning!
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Re: New & overwhelmed with getting started

Post  ashort on 1/12/2012, 10:58 pm

If you are doing longer beds, try to make them run from east to west, that will give you more squares on the north side. Plant taller items on the north edge of the bed and shorter items on the south side. To figure out how the summer sun is going to be, go out to the yard about 12-1 and face south. the sun should be to your south at the point in time. Point at the sun with one hand and then lift it up about 30 degrees (lift your hand up a couple of feet). That should approximate where the sun will be mid-day in the summer. Now trace a line in the sky from horizon to horizon to kinda figure out the sun's path at the height of summer. In our area, you will have about 14-15 hours of sun in the mid summer so you can kind estimate what percentage of the sun's path might be shadowed by trees, etc to calculate how many hours of sun you will get.

As far as planting - planting time for onion sets will be upon us in the next few weeks (I got mine from http://www.dixondalefarms.com/). It is the time to start cooler weather seedlings such as broccoli, cauliflower, cabbage, etc. The seasons do not allow direct seeding of these plants. If you are not doing seedling starts, then start looking around for who will sell transplants, as these will go in the ground in about 6-8 weeks now. I had good luck with bonnie plants (http://www.bonnieplants.com/)last year for transplants - they were available just about everywhere and had tons of varieties. Plan on planting taller items and trellised items on the north side of the beds and shorter items on the south side. Lastly when it comes to planting, plant earlier rather than later - you can always throw some protection over your seedlings, but you need as much time as possible on tomatoes, etc to get a crop in before the high heat of summer gets here in late June-August....

Other than that, just focus on getting the beds set up. I would try to locate some composted chicken pooh, as there are plenty of production facilities out there. Black Kow makes a good composted cow manure. If you can find composted cotton burrs, they are great. I would echo the thought of trying to get compost at a local nursery, as I still think that I got some compost form the big box stores last year that was not done cooking and it caused my first plantings to be less than stellar...
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Re: New & overwhelmed with getting started

Post  clthames on 1/12/2012, 11:10 pm

@TejasTerry wrote:I am new to this myself, and am in South Texas.

I have visited several local garden centers, and found sources for my coarse vermiculite and the 5 different types of manure. I also checked out Craigslist, and found a guy close to me with a llama farm who was selling llama manure. When I went to buy it, he actually gave me most of it for free. I've also found a local source for worm castings at a cheaper price than ordering online.

I hope this gives you some ideas on where to start...As I said, I'm also a newbie, and am going thru what you are....but maybe gave you a few ideas that I've come up with.

Great idea about checking Craigslist for compost. You gave me an idea though . . . There is vet here that has a bunch of exotic animals (including llamas). I bet they have some manure that would make good compost!

Location is a tough one for me. Our house faces North and is a 2 story home. We own the lot to the east of us, which is the end of the street. And our yard is not deep at all (it is very long and narrow). And there is a giant pecan tree behind our yard (not ours) that shades a good part of our yard.

The largest area that gets any decent sun is the half of the extra lot that is closest to our house. But we lose that sun in the afternoon (not sure what time in the summer though). In the backyard, there is an area that gets sun from about mid morning (once the sun passes the pecan tree) and keeps it until late afternoon. But the area is smaller. Big enough for MAYBE 2 4x8 beds.

Which would be better? Morning or afternoon sun? Or perhaps I could utilize both areas and group plants according to sun requirements?
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Re: New & overwhelmed with getting started

Post  clthames on 1/12/2012, 11:18 pm

@ashort wrote: In our area, you will have about 14-15 hours of sun in the mid summer so you can kind estimate what percentage of the sun's path might be shadowed by trees, etc to calculate how many hours of sun you will get.

Other than that, just focus on getting the beds set up. I would try to locate some composted chicken pooh, as there are plenty of production facilities out there. Black Kow makes a good composted cow manure. If you can find composted cotton burrs, they are great. I would echo the thought of trying to get compost at a local nursery, as I still think that I got some compost form the big box stores last year that was not done cooking and it caused my first plantings to be less than stellar...

Yes . . . lots of chicken around here. I should have thought of that before. I know plenty of people who own chicken houses. Do I have time to get fresh chicken poop and let it cook properly?

Since our house sits facing direct north, it's pretty easy to trace the sun's path using your description. Lots of trees and a REALLY narrow (from north to south) lot are going to be my problem!

I try to avoid big box stores anyway! We do have one local nursery here. We also have lots of farms and ranches around here also . . . maybe I should start calling around to see if any sell compost.
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Re: New & overwhelmed with getting started

Post  clthames on 1/12/2012, 11:22 pm

@Unmutual wrote:Your local extension office and Master Gardeners will be more than happy to help you. Here are some links to extension office material for your area.

his shows you what varieties are known to grow in your area. Using the listed varieties will increase your chance of success. This list is important when you are starting out. Some local nurseries will sell things that don't necessarily grow well. It's not their fault per se, it's usually because a lot of people ask for them.

Great information, Thanks! I got a list from the extension office when I first started planning the garden and used that to order my seeds. Now I have decided not to try to start seeds indoors on year one . . . so I'll pull it out and use it to find good plants.
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Re: New & overwhelmed with getting started

Post  clthames on 1/12/2012, 11:23 pm

@madnicmom wrote:some cucumbers and squash are vines. After getting your beds constructed/placement determined and Mel's Mix made, look into trellis material.

Will do! The building part doesn't intimidate me as much as the living plants!!!!!
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Re: New & overwhelmed with getting started

Post  clthames on 1/12/2012, 11:24 pm

@Ha-v-v wrote:I love all the suggestions already put in, lots of things to check out to start. The folks on this forum are totally amazing.

Ha-v-v

YES, they are! I have been amazed at the responses. All great information also. It's nice to know you aren't in it alone!
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